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CatspawDTP — Astral game rules (color)
Published: 2012-09-19 19:10:50 +0000 UTC; Views: 10157; Favourites: 210; Downloads: 1011
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The rules in full color for Sun and Moon—The Astral Game. The PDF file is set up for US letter size (8.5 inches by 11 inches), and is four pages long. It also can be printed from Adobe Acrobat or Reader as a “booklet” on a single sheet of tabloid paper (11 inches by 17 inches), then folded in half.(I apologize for the bizarre category, but Deviantart steadfastly ignores the existence of any game other than digital games.)
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Comments: 367
If the player is wise, certainly. Eclipse doesn’t “kick in” until the start of play, but a player who overlooks it during opening deployment would be in trouble right away.
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Half the challenge, I presume, is actually seeing what's up and figuring out how the positions relate to each other. I haven't had the luck to see the game played, though.
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I haven’t had an opportunity to play, or observe, the game a great deal yet, but one thing I have learned is that the initial deployment corresponds roughly to the opening game in chess, and that the actual beginning of play corresponds approximately to the midgame of chess.
It was a surprising observation, but in retrospect it makes sense: the arrangement of the board makes for a veritable slaughter of pieces fairly quickly.
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Thanks very much! It was a lot of work, but I hope the end result was worth it.
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I finally got around to printing a copy of your game, and I must say I enjoy it quite a bit. I especially like the shape and feel of the board.
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Thanks very much! As far as I know the board lay-out is unique, and did cause some odd headaches: Unlike a more typical rectilinear game board, it has no corners and very little edge, and the cyclic aspect complicated the process of figuring out good moves for the playing pieces.
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I still think that it's much too difficult to capture a unicorn. if you get within 3 stars they can capture you. It's just... impossible to take them without wasting time and/or losing a piece. I think a Unicorn's capture rules need to be revised.
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An earth pony can threaten a unicorn from two stars away, since it is the only soldier allowed to “turn a corner”.
An earth pony or a pegasus can threaten a unicorn from a neighboring star, since a unicorn can’t capture without moving at least one star.
Admittedly, it’s more difficult to threaten a unicorn with a pegasus than with an earth pony, but it can be done. The options expand if another piece is available to guard the first piece.
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Plus, the fact that it's hard to capture is countered by the fact that it's not as easy to banish with, since the attack pattern of Princesses are the same, but with shorter range.
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I thought of a potential solution for a drop-like rule.
It requires a new piece, probably the best fit would be a pet. They would start on circle F on the outer twilight line. They could move one star at a time, and capture on the star they land on. They can move towards the center, or around their current circle, but could not move backward to a larger circle (if on circle D it can't move to circle E). If it lands on the Earth, it turns into a Pegasus, Unicorn, or Earth Pony (players choice), and takes the space the pet was on before it moved onto the Earth (i.e if sun pet on S1A moves onto Earth, it transforms into unicorn, unicorn placed on S1A). Could potentially be limited to own side of firmament.
Obviusly the inspiration for this comes from the chess Pawn.
Either start with 4, giving each side 17 pieces, or subtract one each from pegasus, unicorn, and Earth Pony, adding 3 pets, maintaining 13 pieces per side.
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At the moment, my primary focus is on solving the queen, but it’s an interesting suggestion that solves the directionality issue in an elegant fashion. I’ll have to mull it over.
It’s tempting to call the piece a “shooting star”, since it falls to earth from the heavens.
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I like that term. Good observation.
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You do understand that my pets concept wouldn't quite work like that, right? Though you might not be referring to my pet rules, if you are, pets cant capture, do not start in play, and cant leave your side of the firmament. You have to play them during your turn instead of doing anything else.
That said, I've already made a piece that fills a similar function, the Zebra. I'm actually working on a new version of it right now, though I may wait a day or so before I actually post it. Want to make sure I've thought it through carefully. Having ANY piece be responsible for playing captured pieces automatically limits what you can do with the rule quite a bit, and makes your ability to keep using it tied to keeping that piece out, so I don't think you'd need to go to anywhere near the extremes you did in regards to limiting the process.
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When I said "probably the best fit" I was referring to name alone, sorry for the confusion.
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This is a completely different pet rule, having nothing to do with yours. I came up with this while trying to find a solution to make a version of the drop rule work. I called it pets ,only because that was the closest thing I could come up with to pawns in the pony universe.
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Ah. I see. That was sort of the idea I had behind my Pets concept, for them to be sort of pawns (though you had to give up a turn to play them), and they would be defensive pieces.
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Figure four has an error on the position I label b8. You can't move to a star with a piece on it. Especially not if said piece is your own one!
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That’s to illustrate that the pegasus could land there if the star were unoccupied. The presence of the piece is to illustrate that a pegasus can “fly over” a piece anywhere within its movement range and can “fly over” a friendly piece.
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Double Earth Pony poison muffins combo. Though the reference should be obvious, S1Ep4 Applebuck Season, Pinkie and Applejack make muffins that make everypony sick. How combo works: two adjacent friendly Earth Ponies freeze in place any enemy SOLDIERS (not princess) adjacent to either Earth Pony for one turn. Any non adjacent enemy piece can move freely. Works only for first move, if two Earth Ponies left adjacent does not work on anypony that comes in range. Only for those in range when Earth Ponies first moved adjacent to each other.
Example
SE1=Sun Earth Pony 1, SE2= sun earth pony 2, MP=moon pegasus, MU=Moon Unicorn, ME= Moon Earth Pony
SE1 at S4C, SE2 at M0D, MP at S5D, MU at S2F, ME at S3D
Sun turn, move SE2 to S5C initiating poison muffins combo, MP and ME cannot move next turn
Moon turn, MU move to S4D capturing SE2 at S5C.
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Another unlikely combo: Double Unicorn flyover combo. In Sonic Rainboom Twilight uses spell to give Rarity temporary wings. How combo works: two adjacent friendly unicorns, and adjacent enemy soldier. Presence of friendly unicorn allows other unicorn to flyover capture adjacent enemy piece, landing on opposite side.
Example, SU1=sun unicorn 1, SU2= sun unicorn 2, MP=Moon pegasus
SU1 at S3C, SU2 at S3D, MP at S2C
Sun turn, move SU1 flyover capture MP to S1C
Note:does not extend unicorn's movement range, flyover limited to two stars.
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Still undecided if restricted to enemy piece capture. Could possibly be made to allow friendly piece flyover as well.
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Less likely combo move: Double pegasus save. In both Secret of my Excess and Elements of harmony, Rainbow Dash and Fluttershy save ponies (and spike) from falling to their doom. How combo works: after a unicorn or earth pony (or maybe pegasus) is captured, if player can get two pegasi on opposite sides of where the taken piece was in one turn, taken piece gets put back where it was taken. If occupied by enemy Earth Pony, Enemy Earth Pony gets captured, and replaced by taken piece.
Example:SP1=Sun Pegasus 1, SP2=sun pegasus 2, MU=moon unicorn, SU=sun unicorn
SP1 at S3B, SP2 at S3D, SU at S4B, MU at S2D to start
Moon turn, Move MU to S3C, capture SU at S4B
Sun turn, Move SP2 to S5B, pegasus save, Place SU at S4B
Note: Pegasi must surround captured piece on both sides. Merely having two pegasi adjacent to taken piece will not result in pegasus save.
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Tentative combo suggestion, Earth Pony Unicorn teleport. Secret of my excess for inspiration. Twilight teleporting spike several times, to clean dirty cheek. Suddenly Pinkie Pie appears from teleportation, landing next to Twilight. How combo works: need at least 2 unicorns and 1 Earth Pony same side (i.e. sun or moon) Earth Pony moves onto friendly Unicorn lands adjacent to second friendly Unicorn. If more than 2 friendly unicorns on board, may choose which to appear adjacent to. May not capture with this combo. Earth pony may appear at any unoccupied space adjacent to second unicorn.
Example: SU1=sun unicorn 1, SU2= Sun Unicorn 2, SE=Sun Earth Pony
SU1 at S3C, SE at S5B, SU2 at M4D
SE moves onto SU1 at S3C, SE transported to M5D.
Tell me what you think of these combos, and if they might be implemented into the game.
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My initial reaction is that these are starting to move beyond the traditional styles associated with classical games. They seem to get rather complicated and have a more modern board-game feel to them. I’ll have to examine them more closely after getting the core game nailed down, though; that really is taking most of my attention. I’m copying all of them down into the text file of suggestions so I can find them again!
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The multi-race combos seem more feasible than the single race combos to me. I agree, that it does seem more modern, and complicated than old school strategy games. I haven't personally tried these out yet, so I'm not sure if there are balancing issues to deal with. To be honest, I haven't even played the game once yet, but intend to try it soon.
What I like about these is how I incorporated actions used in the show to make the soldiers interact.
Anyone can feel free to add to these or change them, if they think of something that might work better.
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Even if they don’t get used, they’re valuable as idea-fodder. If one of them sparks even a single nifty addition, I figure they’ve done their job.
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Another possible combo move. Pegasus and Unicorn: Pegasus flies over friendly unicorn, unicorn captures any (or only one) adjacent piece. Thought process: S1Ep23 Cutie Mark Chronicles, Rainbow Dash performs Sonic Rainboom, Twilight's magic amplified tenfold causing Spike to grow to gargantuan size. Had two star doughnut been maintained, I would have made it Extend doughnut to two and three star radius for one turn, but that was already changed. Currently, Unicorns can't attack adjacent ponies, this combo would kill anyone (or just a single chosen one) adjacent to the unicorn at the time.
Example: SU=sun unicorn, SP=sun pegasus, MU=moon unicorn
SU at S4B, SP at S5B, MU at S3C.
SP flies over SU to S3B
SU captures MU at S3C
Same turn
move with Pegasus, capture with Unicorn
BTW Earth Pegasus combo also 1 turn, not 2
two ponies move same turn, Earth to occupied pegasus star, pegasus 4 stars ahead along arc.
Working on Earth, Unicorn combo to balance out.
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I thought of an Earth pony, pegasus combo move. The idea stems from, Applebuck Season where AppleJack launches Rainbow Dash from the catapult "faster than she could take off on her own". It goes, if an Earth Pony is adjacent to a friendly Pegasus, She can move onto that space, then the pegasus can move 4 stars instead of three, away from the direction the Earth Pony came from. It would be allowed to capture during this move, and would therefore have one extra capturing range as well for that turn.
Example Sun Earth Pony on S4A, Sun Pegasus on S4B, Moon Earth Pony S4E. Sun Earth Pony moves to S4B, Sun Pegasus moves to S4F flying over and capturing Moon Earth Pony.
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Okay, starting a new comment for this, because the old comment has way too many replies XD
So, just came up with a new concept for the Zebra that is far more unique than the old one. I am of the opinion that Advanced Soldiers (those outside the core 3) should each be distinctly unique, which is why I was sorely disappointed with my Zebra when I thought more on it later. So, here's my new idea.
Zebra (Recommend 1-4 Zebras)
Zebras must move exactly 3 stars, and must turn a corner each time. A Zebra always turns corners in a right-left-right pattern. Zebras cannot move through occupied spaces. Zebras capture on the third star. Instead of moving or capturing, a Zebra can declare it is "Casting".
While "Casting", a Zebra can move through occupied spaces. The following effect triggers based on the number of occupied spaces passed.
1 occupied: If at least one star was occupied by an opposing piece, if one of your pieces is captured during your opponent's next turn, you may move that piece to a star adjacent to the Zebra. The moved piece cannot move during your next turn.
2 occupied: If at least one star was occupied by an opposing piece, you may take one of your opponent's captured pieces and immediately place it adjacent to the Zebra.
3 occupied: If at least one star was occupied by an opposing piece, if the last star is occupied by an allied piece, that ally can move an additional star during your next turn, and the Zebra can share the star until your next turn, when either the Zebra or allied piece must move. If the last star is occupied by an opponent's piece, you may capture all of your opponent's pieces that you passed.
The whole Casting thing might be a bit too complicated, but I find myself loving the movement. Please tell me what you think.
Here's a link to a pic showing how the Zebra moves. [link]
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That is pretty complicated, especially introducing the concept of differentiating between left and right. I’m not as sure about this one, though some of the others look interesting.
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Casting definitely seems too complicated, and too powerful. This would give the zebra a movement footprint of 6 stars, and a capture footprint of 6 normal, and 18 casting. the movement pattern is interesting, like a lightning bolt shape. That could work I think, but the casting either needs several major tweaks, or should be discarded altogether.
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Yeah, I'm not satisfied with Casting yet. It's definitely on my list of things to consider alternatives to out of all my suggestions. The movement was something I really liked, and I wanted to actually DO something with it when it came to either capturing or the medic effect I wanted for it. But I haven't figured out how to make it work just yet, without over-complicating it.
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Maybe I can inspire someone with these:
Antagonist and the elements:
In some way you can turn your princess evil
(Triggered or enabled by an action or a secuence of actions; It happens when you use a special ability; You can turn your princess evil anytime you want),
becoming evil always brings instant benefits
(A one time ability you used in order to become evil; Your princess acquires the ability to capture enemies that are one star away from her or other movement benefits; She summons one or more "minions"; It enables another way to achieve victory),
but obviously it comes with a price, this would enable the other princess to use of the elements of harmony (Scattered around the board; obtained by skipping turns or sacrificing pieces; You don't need to colect them to use them, in this case the elements would need to be used in a special way; Obtained by performing certain actions eg: Let your adversary undo an action for kindness, give away a captured piece for generosity, show your tainted sister you are still loyal to her by taking two of your soldiers out of the game or by moving a piece to it's original position when she requests it, etc. ),
the elements can have different benefits that reflect the difficulty of acquiring them (Instant victory; movement benefits for the princess that are available at all moments or only affect the other princess (she still moves exactly two stars but the other princess can be eclipsed by the extra movement); You get a cookie in real life :3, just kidding.
Pieces:
Princess's disciple or protege:
Nevermind, It's a unique piece that stacks captured pieces that represent it's experience and knowledge, I already saw that (The dragon).
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This idea seems very complicated. Also, it would be possible to deny a player certain elements, by not taking advantage of those perks. For instance, if One never tries to take back a move, kindness can't be gotten.
More feasible would be to have elements scattered around the board, that would be transferred between players by capturing soldiers bearing them.
Potential problem with this is if there are fewer than 6 soldiers left, it'd be impossible to gain all the elements. Possible solution is to let soldiers carry multiple elements at once.
Princesses should be barred from acquiring elements, else they could never be regained. If a princess captures an element bearer, the element would be left on the board on the spot it was captured.
To gain any element on the board a soldier must land on that star. For princesses they'd act as obstacles.
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Thanks for watching!
As I mentioned elsewhere, I don’t know whether I’ll use every idea I get, but I’ve grabbed your suggestion and copied into the text file I’m using as kind of a “bucket” to throw all the ideas people have been bringing up.
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Since you mentioned my dragon, what do you think of it and my other piece suggestions?
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I think the dragon is a great idea. If I were you I would make his sacrifice ability only activable during it's owner's turn, that would make him more dependant of a good strategy. Maybe I would also make him unable to eclipse the princess for some turns after making a sacrifice or until he captures another piece, I mean, a dragon with four stacks would be just too dangerous for the princess if combined with his sacrifice ability.
The changelings are a nice idea. What you proposed while not really canonical (since a changeling's ability isn't "Copying skills" but deception itself) is simple and pretty.
A more canonical, difficult and complex way to add them to this game would be to (Since they have both horns and wings and not everypony have the same talents) create an earth pony, a unicorn and a pegasus piece with a changeling mark on the bottom side that tells you that the piece is a changeling (Only the owner of the piece will know if the piece is a changeling), they will take the form of the pony that represents the opposite of what their talent is (Changelings that move like earth ponies will transform themselves into unicorns, unicorns into pegasi and pegasi into earth ponies). This would make them a real pain in the neck, so I would only play with a maximum of one or two of them. If one of the players notice that one piece made a movement that could be legal for another, he can ask if the piece is a changeling, if he's wrong, he lose a turn. If a player notice that a piece made an illegal move it's obvious that the pice must be a changeling and he can demand to see the changeling's mark. After a changeling's real identiny is discovered the owner of the changeling can leave the piece facing upwards (The pony) or downwards (The changeling). That would make this game a nightmare for distracted and forgetful people xD
Haha maybe I'll try to play with my weird annoying version of the changelings someday. (Sorry if my english is bad)
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Yeah, that idea for the Changelings sounds way too complicated. I've learned through experience that most people prefer simple, especially when simple can accomplish the overall effect easier than complex stuff can.
The Dragon's sacrifice ability can't work on your own turn, it wouldn't do anything if it did. The whole effect is a defense against capturing, which only happens on the opponent's turn. It also requires a minimum of 3 pieces in the stack, so its not like its instantly on when you get your first capture with the dragon.
Thanks for the comments though. Have you read my comment about Pets and Zebras? It should be in the mass of comments/replies somewhere up there after my dragon/changeling post.
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Yep, simple is way better for this kind of game (The changeling thing was just for the lols).
I was just suggesting it could be "activated" only on your own turn and then the effect would take place on your opponent's turn. That way you must be way more careful.
Yeah, I read about those earlier today, I can't remember much (I'm really tired right now). I remember digging the parasprites hahaha.
I'll read again and give you my opinion tomorrow if you want it, I don't have any experience with this stuff, but I can try to help a lil.
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I notice the rules, even with the revision, make no mention of the alternative set of pieces with the wing, horn, and hoof. Should you perhaps make note of this?
If there is to be a major issue with the new rules, from playtesting, it will likely come from the princess sniping capture. We'll have to see if that will work as intended, or needs to be changed. If it indeed comes to the latter, I would advocate for the teleport capture for the princess.
( To be clear, I am not now advocating for another rule change from the newest revision.)
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I’m hoping the rules are solved. There still may be some difficulty with the princess, though, drat it.
As for the alternate pieces . . . good gravy. That way lies madness; there simply isn’t room in the current rulebook, though I might add a sentence mentioning that there’s a wide variety of possible designs. Anything more detailed would have to go into the ancillary book(let).
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Out of curiosity, have you considered variants that include some of the races as optional pieces? Cause I can think of some interesting ideas for some of the other races shown in the show.
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Write up your ideas and send them along; I want to develop concepts for the game similar to “fairy” pieces and chess problems , to give Sun and Moon some of the same verisimilitude as a world-building artifact. Once I have enough material I plan to develop an adjunct book(let) to go along with the game.
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Should I post them here in the comments? Or would you prefer I send it as a note?
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Either way is fine; there are arguments in favor of both.
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Made a slight mistake. Dragon movement based on stacks is total stack + their base movement of 1. I forgot I changed that half-way through, so the max stack should be 4. That way they can fly up to 5 in an arc, or turn up to 3 times.
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That could get pretty powerful, which doesn’t make it a bad idea—just something to be careful with.
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That's why I was very careful with how I build the Dragon. It has to capture to get the stacks, and it only moves 1 without stacks. Sure, if you manage to protect it long enough to feed it, it becomes a monster, but that takes both careful planning, and time. It's also lore appropriate.
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