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ikr — Thoughts on style
Published: 2016-03-19 21:39:16 +0000 UTC; Views: 15348; Favourites: 274; Downloads: 0
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Disclaimer: this is a general reflection on the subject and it's not related to any specific case. I've seen this happening countless times, and the case going on recently isn't the first or the last on the matter. You're free to post your opinions but please refrain from mentioning any case in particular. Comments containing names or even hints about any case will be removed.
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I feel a lot of people use the "you can't copyright a style" shield way too much, either conscious or unconsciously. Which is, in my humble opinion, such a lame statement as saying "you can't copyright a personality" or "you can't copyright your way of doing things". Well of course you can't, because they're not products or labels.
I wonder what would happen if person A started imitating person B's personality and mannerisms to the point of wearing the same clothes, dying their hair the same color as person B's, copying not only their gestures and facial expressions but also their ideas and way of thinking, and when person B asked them to stop, person A said "but you can't copyright how you are!". I think Person A would be technically correct, but would they even take a second to think how ridiculous that sounds?. And I'm not precisely talking about music stars or famous people who sell their own image and aim to make a trend out of themselves.
Style is a very personal thing, especially in art. It's either something you create or discover, but in any case you end up polishing for years. There are artists who have a very distinctive style from the beggining, and there are others that need time, sometimes years to discover or create their own. Add up the time and effort and personal investment it takes to polish it to a point where you're satisfied with it. It may not be something completely new and original, as such thing doesn't exist, but the way of using the resources you've been gathering and the things you've been learning for years is. Having someone coming and taking it, investing only a 5% of their time to learn how to copy it, and then exposing it as something of their own creation (and sometimes making profit off it), well... I agree it's not illegal. But how low is that?
We all learn by copying, we all need to observe and replicate in order to learn. We're all influenced by our favourite artists. We all wish we could be "as good as" the artists we admire. But there's a tiny line separating inspiration from imitation .
I'm not even saying it's wrong to copy, as long as you do it for learning purposes. It's ok and healthy to learn from others. It's perfectly normal to admire an artist or an art style and wanting to be as good as them. It's even acceptable to absorb part of their style at the beggining and use it as a foundation of your own style. But after that you have to start building your own. It's not something easy and it WILL take time, but that's exactly what the artist you admire so much went through before. Style is something very personal and if you purposely dedicate your time to learn how to replicate it without adding anything of your own, you're literally saying you don't respect the original artist and you're actually harming yourself by not allowing yourself to grow. If you think you can't help but getting heavily influenced by them, then find more inspirations, mix them together, make your own interpretation of that mix, find some more, expand your horizons. There's always a solution when you have the intention.
If you don't care about your own realization as an artist though, and you're only seeking fast attention and popularity on internet because it helps you cope with your RL insecurities, well, you're probably doing it right by the time being but it won't last long. In the end you'll always get caught and it actually won't help one bit to solve your RL problems.
I never understood why the quote "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" got shortened (twisted?) in order to make it look as if imitators and copycats are doing other people a favor by mimicking them. The original quote is "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness." . I'm pretty sure Oscar Wilde wouldn't have felt very flattered if someone else had stolen his manuscripts, changed the title and some details, and published it saying it was their own work. Of course many interpretations can be made, but considering he is a writer with one of the biggest egos in history, I think what he meant was that from the moment you start imitating someone else you become mediocre, and what's worse, by being mediocre you're letting other people be greater than you.
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Comments: 79
Well, I'd be bothered by plagiarism but I'd think it would be hilarious if someone started dressing and acting like me. They'd be worshipping me!
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it would get creepy eventually, like a stalker xDDDD
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Yeah, then you have to go through the awkward conversation where you tell them no, they can't cut your face off and wear it because you're still using it.
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Its hard for me to see problem with ppl having similar styles or using someones style as starting point. The reason is that I do believe that style is something that will come naturally as long as you keep drawing, even if you start with someone elses style little by little you start to find things that dont look too good for you and change them. Unless you are constantly fighting against the way you naturally want to draw with continues effort (meaning you would have reference of that style out all the time when drawing, otherwise your style is destined to change with time towards your true style.) Why I think I can say that, well lets just say that thats the case with myself (I am still pretty early in learning thou.) Well I guess if you want to speed the process of having your own style you should do more diverse studies about many different styles, artists and techniques including drawing from real life. Well the end point is still this, everyones style is living, always changing thing so in my eyes this fighting and drama over subject is a bit pointless, everyone is just at their own point of their own travel, did their paths of style overlap or not, it won't (or at least shouldn't) stay that way forever. This all of course given that people are in some degree wise and willing to grow as artist and don't knowingly fight against it forever (that I doubt not many will do after noticing it.)
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There's nothing wrong with budding artists copying their inspirations work, but rather the integrity of it. IKR is pretty much saying what you have said where its acceptable to be inspired and copy and pick and choose parts of styles to eventually amalgamate your own.
There are, however, inexperienced people out there who will trace or heavily reference another artist but then go around claiming its their original idea and then say 'don't steal/trace/copy/reference/ect...' which is the definition of a hypocrite. Most people let it go as karma does its work sometimes... But there are worse cases where these inexperienced people take it too far and profit off of the style via commissions and compliments. They can offer it at a cheaper and quicker rate than the original artist who work at least twice as long to produce their content. Sure, the imitator's quality may not be as good as the original artist, but if its good enough, it won't stop naïve people from buying. And there are people who imitate just to fish for compliments, praise, and popularity for their 'art' that they don't work hard for. They're pretty much becoming their inspirer at this point... These people don't stop until either their idol calls them out and make them go into hiding, their idol just stops making art and they don't have anything to work off from anymore, or they find someone else to rip off.
Bringing this topic up isn't necessarily pointless because there are young impressionable people who need to know 'hey, copying your admire is cool and all, but don't become them' before they do the incorrect things and get into a mess like this.
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I am completely speechless, very beautiful journal I will link to anyone who needs to read it.
I always knew it was just morally wrong but I needed the words to back it up.
Please never delete this.
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This is worded really really nicely >///<
Thank you for this, I doubt I could have put it into words as good as you <3
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opino igual.
En cuanto al estilo creo igual, uno normalmente empieza COPIANDO. Sea de la TV -cuando aun no conocíamos o teníamos acceso al internet - O luego de personas que admiramos mucho.
El estilo es algo que es difícil de conseguir, algo propio y distintivo sobre el resto y como has dicho es algo que se puede hacer luego de mucho esfuerzo y dedicación, a algunos -lo digo por mi- nos cuesta años lograr un resultado que nos satisfagan. Pero yo no creo que esté mal -al principio- tomar elementos de otros artistas pero no TODO de un artista, sino ir viendo que cosa de cada artista gusta e ir mezclando probando combinaciones hasta lograr o encontrar algo que nos guste :3
Ya lo malo es cuando se hace abuso, copian y se lo toman como que ese dibujo es propio y no de otro. :/
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Oh my god I agree with you wholeheartedly.
Thank you so much for making this journal as I would have never been able to explain this so perfectly to those who always throw the "you can't copyright a style" card.
And also thank you for the full quote!
It's not something I knew of since I've seen so sO many people use the shortened version @ _ @;;
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This Journal is refreshing and gives you something to think about thanks <3
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wow, I never knew that that quote was actually a shortened version! Thanks for sharing the original; it's has so much more meaning now C=
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woa! this is...clarifying, to say the least!
now I am free with da truuuuuuuuuuuuuu!
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??did you accidentally reply to my comment? I don't understand what you are trying to say...
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Ups, yup. I accidentally repllied your comment
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I agree with you so much TTwTT
also the part where you mentioned person A copying person B in almost every manner reminded me of this recent kdrama i watched called Cheese in the Trap and based off a manga/manwha or smth and one of the side characters ends up wanting to be like the main girl so much that she literally starts copying her appearance and even her old presentation for a class while denying everything and even arguing back against them and they got really upset about it cause it just felt so wrong and awkward lol...
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Haha honestly and contrary to tv shows or mangas, I don't think people that do that IRL do it because they want to be as -whatever- as the other person, but more because they want for themselves what the other person has? (call it looks, money, popularity, friends, success, whatever). I have no doubt it starts out as admiration. I also believe that depending on what kind of education they had / are having they're more inclined to doing what others do instead of trying new things on their own, or maybe they want to try by themselves but it takes a lot of time and effort.
In any case, in terms of imitating someone (not in art, but in general) is something natural especially when you're young, but the more you grow and become a mature person you start learning about yourself and changing on your own. It's probably the same with art, and I don't think it's a problem, unless you completely imitate the other person and you stay there not willing to grow
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lol yeah =w= it'd be pretty weird if they did...don't think i've seen anyone really try to imitate someone irl to that point tho.
And yep, I wish more people would realize it's better to find their own style, even if it's a bunch of other styles they like mixed together, but as long as it doesn't look extremely close or the same as a single other person's style it's fine i think. It's just sad when people literally try to copy down to the way they draw certain traits/objects/details is the same as another artist and it's really obvious when looking at it. It makes me not want to support the wannabe artist much cause I'd rather watch someone who does their best to be unique and creative with their style/art rather than someone who merely tries to draw just like someone else they admire instead of doing their own thing, especially when it comes to adopts too.
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"Style is something very personal and if you purposely dedicate your time to learn how to replicate it without adding anything of your own, you're literally saying you don't respect the original artist and you're actually harming yourself by not allowing yourself to grow."
This is so true and so perfect. It sums up everything quite well I think. I personally dont agree with the idea of 'you cant copywright a style' or 'you cant copy a style'. I dont think its ok if two people have styles so similar you can confuse them, which happens so much nowadays.
Thank you for the journal, and for posting the FULL quote about imitation and flattery.
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I agree it happens a lot nowadays, maybe because it's a difficult topic and you have to keep in mind a lot of factors when judging, so there are mixed opinions on the subject as a whole.
Thank you for reading!
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Thank you for writing such a detailed opinion on this matter and for including the full quote at the end.
I'm still struggling to develop my own style after over a decade, but reading this really gave me some revelation. To those of us still are endeavoring on this quest filled with much strife, I greatly thank you for taking the time to write this so well, Izu
I hope that your words will be taken to heart--they have with me.
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Gosh you're always so sweet and polite T_T <333 *hugs*
I'm also still trying to be happy and satisfied with my own style, I feel I'll never be 100% happy with it but any drop of satisfaction counts. I also believe that style changes according to time, even after you feel yourself a realized artist, but the foundation always stays firm.
I wish you the best *__* you draw really beautiful pieces and I hope you can find that one thing that makes you think "this is what feels natural to me"
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I think the thing with a lot of people (not just artists in particular) is that they get confused with what is a "copyright" versus "copying". People throw around the word "copyright" too easily now without realizing what it means. Like even in the near-past, how dA posted that announcement about copying vs copyright; it wasn't worded in the best way (especially since it made it seem like they didn't care about our fellow artists anymore), but it did bring up real points about the topic at hand.
Otherwise, I agree with your points as well; I think if one is copying (and preferably crediting) an artist for the sake of practice and learning, it's fine. It only then becomes "copyright" when you claim the original artists work as your own as it becomes a legal issue. The gray line for me is when you develop your own style to be very similar to someone else's, whether by chance or on purpose. Maybe as long as the content and inspiration are different and there is no other relation to the original artist aside from style, I can see it working. That said, I've met quite a handful of people on dA that so happened to have similar style and also work with similar themes (to the point I thought they were the same person), but it doesn't make me discredit their work. I think it's just because they had the same interest and same idols that their works look similar, but they are all obviously not copying each other.
Anyway, I don't know what I was getting at... lol. Just my two cents, I guess. > w <;;
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True! copyright is a legal term, therefore saying that you can't copyright a style is obvious, and saying it to defend yourself sounds more like "I can do this because it's not illegal and you have no right to complain".
I think you mentioned an important point there when you said "whether by chance or on purpose". It's true that there are cases where it's not even your intention but you still get influenced. Some kind of unconscious influence similar to when you travel to another country or place and you start using their accent?. But of course, when the similarities are caused by mere unconscious influence, I think even a 3rd person can tell, because they're partial similarities and not 99% the other artist's style.
Thank you for your two cents!
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Agreed. And talking about works that aren't for practice: copying a style isn't copyright, but it is frowned upon between a majority of artists. But I think for a lot of cases, because the artist that falls victim get so flustered and upset, they forget about the difference between copying (which is bad, but isn't illegal) vs copyright infringement (which is bad and illegal lol) and interchange the terms thinking they are the same to prove that their case is worse than it is. I'm not saying that it isn't wrong, however, just it usually is blown out of proportion and why I stay away from drama llamas... haha...
This gets even more confusing in the adoptable world because of original species. I mean, I've seen a looot of designs that are quite similar to very popular designs, but it's such a grey area. I mean unless there is explicit proof or very, VERRRRY strong resemblance to the 'original designs', I usually give people the benefit of the doubt even if I do squint at the designs. Not to mention this is difficult to prove since everyone has a different definition of "copying" (ex. the percentage of similarities one can have before one thinks it's a copy; I personally think if it reaches about 85%+ similarities overal, I think that is a copy). Because for one, unless it's actually patented and claimed to be original enough that it can be patented, it is then a "copyright issue". Other than that, yea, it sucks to have your original species copied and usually butchered and sold for even cheaper; it's just bad energy being passed around, which create an even more paranoid cycle of artists who then want to start using the "copyright" term and etc.
But man, that accent analogy is a great one. I remember going to Singapore (as my relatives are from there) and accidentally picking it up, making my cousins think I was trying to be funny or mocking them. It wasn't that I was trying to copy or even did it consciously, but it was because I stayed there for about a month it just grew on me, lol.
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