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Lazarus-D β Abortion Stops a Beating Heart
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Published: 2007-01-15 22:16:25 +0000 UTC; Views: 21188; Favourites: 782; Downloads: 136
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billboard in Villa Grove, IllinoisManip:
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Comments: 1164
Hell, we massacre millions of bacteria daily, pills or no pills. Our immune system sees to that.
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And your point is?
Should we let bacteria kill us?
Because in some circumstances an abortion is just as necessary as penicillin. Should we allow a fetus to grow (and likely die anyway) and kill a fully developed life?
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There was no point, beyond reinforcing your's.
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Oh jeez I knew I would have regretted posting this.
Fine fine, you win. I'm wrong and you're right. I'm too tired to debate
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There is no debate. Except whether or not virus's are alive. But no further.
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Oh well. *to tired to write more*
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A beating heart is worthless if it does not act as a support mechanism for a sentient mind.
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... Do you eat shellfish? If yes, are their hearts worthless for keeping them alive until they are big enough for you to eat? HUH?
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... Is that to eating shellfish?
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no, to the second part
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wait, what constitutes a shell fish?
i eat shrimp
do those count
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And if carrying out the pregnancy kills the woman?
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There is a big difference between necessary abortion and elective abortion. Most pro life people are against Elective abortion. Not the necessary kind.
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Yeah I can understand that argument even if I don't agree with it 
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Yeah they also give everyone else in the group a bad rep unfortunately. I am not heartless, i care for women who have the misfortune of having a dangerous life threatening pregnancy. At that moment, it becomes a medical issue a tragic medical issue. And everything should be done to save her life. However if the mother can survive a pregnancy but just doesn't want to because it inconveniences her...i think that is wrong and selfish. But if you disagree I respect your opinion and politely agree to disagree.
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Ideally there would be no need for an abortion, but there always will be a need. Though I think through better education, sex education, support and welfare systems and a change in rape culture the numbers could be reduced.
I think for an issue for abortion it depends on the woman, different women have different morals and feelings towards abortion. But saying that I'm happy with the laws my country has for it. (Two doctors permission needed, a reason for it and no abortion after 22 weeks unless it's a medical reason.)
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Yes better education is a must, but with the amount of contraceptives floating around I feel pregnancy is very easily avoidable (i know its not 100% garenteed but the amount of abortions that go on daily in america is much too high for people to be using them correctly. Even if you miss taking a contraceptive there is always the day after pill which is easily obtainable. It just depresses me how often I hear teenagers referring to abortion as a form of birth control. Its sickening.
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Actually abortion doesn't stop a bearting heart. Prior to the cut off date for abortions a feutus does not have a beating heart... Not that it would matter even if it does: You know what else stops a beating heart? Your love of meat... All those animals were killed so that you could eat a hamburger.
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... Another fucking ignorant nut. You average foetus develops a goddamn heartbeat as early as 3/4 weeks. Most countries allow abortion up until the end of 1st trimestre. 3 months. Quite a few even go up to second trimestre. 6 months.
Well done. You've scored the fuckwit another point.
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Its not a sustainable heart beat mate, which as far as medicine is concerned makes it not a heart beat... Its like saying that you shouldn't get rid of that old lemon of a car because it still goes, when what you mean is it still goes as long as its being toed by a tow-truck. LOL
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Ok what about the fact that so called "non sentient" being can feel pain? That it can hear your voice? That when you tear it limb from limb it can feel every second of it.
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An just FYI a feutus cannot be torn limb from limb since 90% of abortions are performed no later then the 8 week mark, when the feutus is about the same size as a pea. You need to stop being overly dramatic & learn a little about the actual procedure, rather then just assuming everyone involved is some sort of horrible monster.
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I am not being overly dramatic and i never acused any one of being a monster. I have learned and watched the actual procedure. I find it hard to believe 90% of abortions are performed no later than 8 weeks because every one i personally know who has had an abortion had it when they were almost 3 months into the pregnancy. Thank you for your indept and scientific reply, I appreciate it and will take it to heart.
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"I am not being overly dramatic"
Oh in that case, you ignorant of fact. Your choice: You either no the facts & are choosing to distort them by being overly dramatic, or you believe what you are saying & are ignorant. Your choice which one of those two it is.
"I have learned and watched the actual procedure."
No you haven't, as no one else is allowed into the operating room. At best you've watched an incredibly biased emotionalised video.
"I find it hard to believe 90% of abortions are performed no later than 8 weeks because every one i personally know who has had an abortion had it when they were almost 3 months into the pregnancy"
An now you've moved on to the logical fallacy known as "appeal to ignorance," or "appeal to personal opinion" as some people have taken to calling it.
At this point i'm going to assume that you are a white female christian, who lives in the suburbs in the USA, possibly still under your parents roof. Probably older then the age of consent, but not old enough to legally drink beer. I think maybe you should jump online, and look up some facts on abortion & no i don't mean on a religious website: Stick with pure science. Its a well established fact, as part of the public record that 90% of abortions are comnpleted no later then 8 weeks.
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A feutus does not feel pain until 20 weeks (by which time 90% of abortions are already completed. Late term abortions beyond that point being medically necessary). Elements of the pain-conveying system (spino-thalamic system) begin to be assembled at 7 weeks; enough development has occurred by 12-14 weeks that some pain perception is likely, and continues to build through the second trimester. By 20 weeks, the spino- thalamic system is fully established and connected.
Anatomical
- pain receptors spread over the body in stages: 8-16 weeks
- pain impulse connections in the spinal cord link up and reach the thalamus (the brain's reception center): 7-20 weeks (summarized by Anand, K.J.S., Atlanta)
Fetuses do have reflex reactions that can make them seem pained, If you see a fetus in utero react to needle stimulation, then the common conclusion is that it must feel. But just as with paraplegics, that's a reflex that's mediated by the spinal cord; that's not a conscious reaction. It is possible that a temporary structure of neurons that appears in a fetus's brain during the second trimester allows it to sense pain. But science believes a fetus's brain doesn't function coherently enough to be conscious of the pain.
So please don't watch something like The Silent Scream & then try to judge from something like that alone.
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... My god this place is crawling with idiots.
It is constant. It is a developping heart. I fact all within the first trimestre it starts pumping it's own blood round it's own circulatory system. I'd call that sustainable personally.
Either way, point is moot seen as we're talking about a heartbeat point, and virtually no-one here is talking from a medical point of view are they?
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To the coward who'd block me rather than be humiliated:
"A fetus's heart beats way to fast to actually survive & the reason it beats so fast is its not actually pumping its own resources, but that of the host."
Completely wrong. The heart and vascular system(blood included) all develop entirely seperately from the host's. Mum and baby do not mix blood once.
Nobody says that heart will survive or is capable of supporting the foetus alone, so that entire point is completely irrelevant to this discussion. The heart is pumping liquid round a sperate vascular system as early as 7 weeks. Basically the majority of abortions stop a beating heart.
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" It is a developping heart"
Which is not the same thing as a developed heart. A developed heart is one that is self sustainable. A fetus's heart beats way to fast to actually survive & the reason it beats so fast is its not actually pumping its own resources, but that of the host.
Its not until Maternalβfetal heartbeat phase synchronization is acheived is the heart considered to be vaible & its not until birth that its considered to be "beating" as a beating heart is independent of the host.
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So does eating meat, or using bug spray, or putting your pet to sleep, or allowing world hunger to exist.
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although I am against abortion, it is illegal to abort a fetus after 3 months because the heart starts beating. before those 3 months, the heart does not beat, it is not even fully formed. The only reason abortion is legal in those 3 months is because the government defines it as an 'undefined mass of cells'. Once again, I think abortion is wrong, but i don't think it should be illegal. The need for abortion is what we should target and get rid of.
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But its been proving the heart starts beating after 3 to 4 weeks. Ever seen inside the womb? Great program
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How many of these troll fuck ups are there in this world?
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So does killing a roach. They have hearts, yet nobody thinks twice about crushing them, burning them or dousing them in poisons.
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So, you equate human life with roach life? Killing a baby is the same thing as killing a bug to you?
Interesting.
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I never said that, so nice try. If abortion is wrong because it stops a beating heart, then by that logic it is also wrong to kill a roach. Both have hearts, both killed. If you think I'm saying a roach and an unborn are equal, then you are wrong. Also, a baby is a term of endearment, not a medically correct term.
I find it interesting that you are close to two months late in replying. A bit slow on the draw?
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Clearly the point being made here is the fact that a human life is being ended, not simply the fact that a heartbeat stops. It's obviously talking about human hearts, not cockroaches. Abortion doesn't stop the heartbeat of a cockroach. The creator of this stamp didn't have to blatantly state that for it to be clear.
They could've said "Abortion ends a human life" or they could've said "Abortion stops a beating heart". It obviously is meant to mean the same thing.
I'm not the creator of this stamp.
And even if I was, the time I took to respond is very trivial. I wouldn't be required to respond to you, and perhaps I had more important things to do with my time.
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That is obvious, however that is a comparison. If abortion is wrong because it stops a beating heart then killing a roach is wrong because it also stops a heart.
I never said you where, however replying to a comment that is already about two months old is pretty sad. Try commenting faster or not at all haha.
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You're missing the point. The point being made here is not just the fact that a heart has stopped beating. The point being made is the fact abortion kills children.
For example, I'm sure this person has nothing against heart transplants, which when preformed, the heart is stopped temporarily. Obviously the point being made is not simply the fact a heart stops. More so, the intuitive meaning is that a human life is being ended. Stop trying to be cute.
How so? Has your opinion changed since two months ago? I see nothing wrong with responding two months later, for that's when I saw your comment. But if it really disturbs you that much, by all means, don't feel the need to reply.
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Abortion doesn't kill children, it kills an embryo, fetus or zygote. Children are already born.
I'm not trying to be cute, I'm giving comparisons. I see anti choicers do that constantly, so why is it bad when I do it?
Nope it hasn't changed, it's just pointless to reply to an old comment since I have no further interest in this deviation. If you want to renew my interest in it then go right ahead haha.
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Still hasn't breathed yet...meaning it has not lived yet.
your argument is invalid.
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Do you know what alive means?
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Yes I do. My argument is now halfly-invalidated.
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Wholly from a bacteria's point of view.
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And what if the mother would die carrying the baby?
That would stop two beating hearts.
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This idiot seems to be ignoring the logical comments like this one.
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